Discussion: blacktop 20v: the road beyond 200HP

[SekiguchiUeno]

my opinion too, 20v is an relativelly cheap package also for me to get power around 160-170, you have all inklusive bodies, cams underbuckets and better bottom end,even the stock ecu is enough. this would cost lot more to buy it in 16v.

i am curious about stock ecu of blactop, can it be remaped?

[86er]

as far as ecu remapping goes it think its much more cost effective to use full a full engine management system.

I do agree pass the 220 mark it would be very expensive compared to 20v, we started tuning my car this weekend and man oh man it feels good cant wait till its complete so we can fine tune on dyno and see what the numbers looks like

[domi]

bumping the all too interesting topic.
What little research i've done is full of people stating 200hp is easy to achieve. Methinks - if you manage 200 at the wheels and keep the overall weight to a tonne, which is not hard considering that's pretty much what it weighs - that's 5kg per hp, damn good. Better than a stock S2000 for less than a tenth of the price, even if you're looking at second hand. My question is quite obvious - what is the minimum required amount of mods you'd need to push 200 at the wheels? Is it possible without changing internals, is it possible with just an amped up fuel feeding system and proper engine management, MegaSquirt even? Do the stock camshafts have to go? Extrapolate, people, take our selfish attempts at leeching from your knowledge as a compliment!

[edit]
P.S. 86er, update your topic, man, your project is one of my main sources of inspiration! I really want to see your ride going and some feedback on the suspension, I'm being lazy on mine until the snow melts around here and am trying to gather all the info i can before i start ordering all the junk that'll need to be swapped.

[BenR]

200 at the wheels would be approx 240bhp!.......so yes, all stock components aprt from the crank would need to go.

If you want 200bhp from the engine alone, then pistons, cams, headwork are the minimums you'll have to touch on.

[edgar350z]

So, overall if you want an engine running 200-220 whp a 20v would be good?

[BenR]

wheel HP is significantly higher than fly, and a 20v i would not use for such high outputs as you would spend just as much changing all the parts that you would have to on a 16v.

[domi]

fair enough - what's a good whp mark to aim for cheaply and reliably on stock internals, which are teflonated or so i hear...? HP figures really don't mean a lot to me, but i still want to know how my swap would stack up to others, as an indication of possible malfunctions/impending doom. From what i hear the ITB setup on stock blacktops is nearing the limits of response that would ever be utilised on street use, what about mid-range torque? Could that be improved whilst keeping the stock power figures?

[86er]

well i dont think u can get past 160whp peak on a stock internal motor an dit wont be easy gettin there. Probably more realisticly 150whp with bolt ons and management. But with a fair amount of work, not nessacarily a huge amount.. ID say, good port job, right cams(vvt killers sorry ) and a bump in compression to get it as close to 12:1 and well balanced bottem end you could get to 170whp or very close once everything is working well together. I'm gonna wait and see what the high lift cams and oversize valves can do but thats in future cuz right now my car is smoking so need to rebuild (rings might as well do everythin one time) car pulls real good though at moment still a few hickups on map but when it goes out smooth its like . Will have to get some vids. Haha since i was driving I have forgotten where my camera is im sooo exited

[BenR]

We will see what paz does soon with a stock bottom end and some midly modified top end components.