Shifting Weight

Joined: 04 May 2006 Posts: 7 Location: USA (from Greece)

hey guys.
im kinda new to the drifting scene, and i am having some problems with my 86 drift.
i can countersteer out of a drift ok and all, but going into one im lacking somethin. im thinkin that i need to shift the car weight more to the other side for outer force, but i cant get it to happen.
can ne 1 tell me how to better shift the car's weight?
thx

Posted: Fri May 05, 2006 7:27 am Post subject:

I'm by no means a drifter, but if you want to initiate your drift using weight shifting you'll have to practice your feint drifting (otherwise known as the scandinavian flick). Before turning into the corner first steer sharply in the opposite direction and back again. You should look up some Formula Drift vids, one of the club4AG drifters clearly uses the technique all the time (taka or hiro...dont know which one).

Posted: Fri May 05, 2006 9:19 am Post subject:

i am total beginner and the most easy technique to initiate slide without handbrake is hard braking(weight transfer from rear to front) combined with shift lock a little after "weight is transfered".

Posted: Fri May 05, 2006 9:34 am Post subject:

That'll work too, but is not too good for your tyres and driveline..

Posted: Fri May 05, 2006 9:38 am Post subject:

Posted: Fri May 05, 2006 9:39 am Post subject:

Locking the tyres will wear them down flat in spots...much more so than any other drift method (except for the handbrake), I'd rather have more even tyre wear.

Posted: Fri May 05, 2006 10:17 am Post subject:

Posted: Fri May 05, 2006 11:31 am Post subject:

You can tell when a driver has used the handbrake. It shows on the rear wheels and it shows on the abruptness of break of traction.

@TakeItSideways: Sounds like you're having the same problems I had in the beginning. I assume you also have stock suspension. The problem is that you brake too early into the corner. That combined with the fact of worn bushings and soft suspension means that you don't make full use of weight transfer and the suspension parts absorb most of what you DO transfer. My advice is: Get the drift bible and learn it by heart Smile

Then you can try worn rear tyres. The rear will break loose much easier, even with very little weight transfer. Worn rear tyres will also help you when trying to brake late into the corner. Most stock AE86 will understeer during hard brake&turn situations and worn rear tyres help balance things out.

Apart from that, increase the responsiveness of your car to torsional changes. Only way to do that is get some fresh bushings and better springs-shocks. The more responsive the car, the better your chances of getting it right.

Good luck

Takumi Joined: 07 Oct 2005 Posts: 372 Location: Wroclaw PL

Ivan: I really don't understand how you can talk about even tyre wear....

who cares how they wear... it's drifting, tyres wear out within minutes... it's not the Le Mans, where flat spots will hurt your performace... and you won't get flat spots from a short lockup... not noticable anyway.

Posted: Fri May 05, 2006 1:45 pm Post subject:

I'm only try a little drift occasionally, I dont switch tyres, and I dont shred them to pieces in 15 minutes. Therefore flatspots suck and will throw off the balance of the wheel too much. Furthermore your differential and gearbox are not built to suddenly lock up, and you will wear things down much faster, or break stuff. I think it's a sloppy way of handling your material, if you want to do this, try it in the rain.

Posted: Fri May 05, 2006 1:48 pm Post subject:

just speed into a corner, accel off and do the flick (left-right). that makes even the passenger bus go sideways Very Happy

Joined: 04 May 2006 Posts: 7 Location: USA (from Greece)

thx for the tips guys
but wont loosening the grip on the rear tires make too hard to exit the turn because of too much oversteer?
same with the flick tech. ive tried it and, probably im doing it too much or too long, but i cant exit the drift from the oversteer.

Posted: Fri May 05, 2006 7:19 pm Post subject:

Feint works very well with my hachi, but that haves to do because the suspension setup, last year with my past s14a, i could only drift with clutch kicks, shift locks and handbrake .. without weight shifting then. Hachi rules Thumbsup

Posted: Fri May 05, 2006 7:19 pm Post subject:

That will only help you learn better throttle control. Only pros can get away with flooring it all the time. Learn to coordinate countersteer with gas. More gas, more oversteer, more counterster. Countersteer has to be done early. If you wait too long, you'll spin.

As for the corner exit rear end grip, for me the best learning day was at an empty lot with loads of rain falling. Minimum grip, low speeds, exagerated car response to all input i gave it. Give it a try (next yar probably Puh

)

Joined: 04 May 2006 Posts: 7 Location: USA (from Greece)

in regards to the feint drift how long and how much should i been steering.
is it like a half second flick or a 2 second flick? and do i just budge the wheel or make a 90 degree turn of the wheel?

Posted: Sat May 06, 2006 10:48 am Post subject:

It really depends on how fast you're going and on the state of your suspension and tyres. There's no definite answer to this.

Posted: Sat May 06, 2006 10:50 am Post subject:

like some of the others said, watch keichi's drift bible...ot top gear's burning rubber vid, where ex-F1 driver Tiff Needell gets a fwd ford sideways using the scandinavian flick... That should give you an idea.
But the best way IMHO, would be to get out there and practice in a safe place.

Iketani Joined: 26 Jan 2006 Posts: 38

Posted: Sat Jul 22, 2006 1:17 pm Post subject:

Soft and hard suspensions will both shift exactly the same amount of weight I'm affraid.

Iketani Joined: 26 Jan 2006 Posts: 38

Posted: Sat Jul 22, 2006 6:37 pm Post subject:

The stiffness of your suspension only dictates the speed in which weight is shifted. The stiffer it gets, the slower the weight transfer will be.

Posted: Sat Jul 22, 2006 9:20 pm Post subject:

Ghe ghe...WRONG! Smile

Ok a car with a given wheelbase and weight in a certain G-corner, shifts exactly the same amount of mass..its simple physics..draw a free body diagram and all will be clear. So hamsup: the weight transfer is the same too.

Ivan, a stiffer suspension shift weight more quickly then a soft suspension. not the other way around. It makes it easier to induce a shockload on the tires and break them loose..It also means that the transition fase is over more quickly.

Iketani Joined: 26 Jan 2006 Posts: 38

ok ok just to let you know i m not trying to start an argument here just want to debate ok Very Happy

on my earlier post i said.
that is true, the car weighs excatly the same whether you have soft or hard suspension but with stiffer suspension, you get to shift more aggressively the weight of the car thus creating a more weight transfer.

i think rewording what i should had said is
that is true, the car weighs excatly the same whether you have soft or hard suspension but with stiffer suspension, you get to shift more aggressively the weight of the car thus creating a more effective weight transfer.

Posted: Sun Jul 23, 2006 12:43 am Post subject:

Posted: Sun Jul 23, 2006 4:01 pm Post subject:

Thats exactly what I wrote down..Exactly the same amount shifted, but quicker. In the end, the corner you take has a fixed radius..so the whole one hour story isn't true either:
same corner

same car

same line

same weight shifted