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VEMS discussion
11-24-2006, 07:40 PM
Post: #41
VEMS discussion
Yes, I mean DIY (sorry but English is not my native language).
Megasquirt already guys developed next generation of their ECU, two more projects are on the way too. In fact they lack just WB and K-type probe control - matter of time to integrate these in next generation ECU. In addition they have too much collateral projects that can be used in automotive applications.
In contrast VEMS is improved too little from 3.1 - just fixes Confused

Don't get me wrong - I tracked VEMS when this was still MegasquirtAVR project and I was excited (I worked with AVRs). But later the development was delayed and now I'm a bit disappointed. I expected more information and user support base. If I need dealers and aftermarket support - I can get them using commersial ECU, no need to make expensive experiments without any warranty.

PS: I forgot one important thing - "IMHO" :wink: Sorry if something is not proven fact - I just showed my point of view.
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11-24-2006, 08:51 PM
Post: #42
VEMS discussion
Your english is just fine sir.

What changes were you expecting to see in the hardware? There is no need to make a change for changes sake.

What may have looked like a halt in design was not actually the way things were, we had to stop public development because some of the hardware and firmware code was stolen by a company who built a system using it. All development is now done by people who have signed a Non Disclosure Agreement (NDA).

There is constant development on new products and software, this new generation of MS is only just able to bring it up to our V3 (crank and cam sensing with ignition coil drive) and it was a long time coming, much longer than I feel you'll admit. Yes it only takes some work to get EGT and WBO2 integrated but that work still has to be done, tested and proven. As for additional projects there are many on the way too, any developing system will have future projects until they arrive they are irrelivent. You can buy a VEMS stand-alone Wideband and EGT guage right now, where is MS's one?

Once again you slander us with another posting though, where do you get the idea that a built and tested VEMS comes with no warranty? It is sold under EU laws of consumer protection, and therefore has to be fit for purpose - you do not get this with a kit, if you want to buy the components and solder them then you have much more limited warranty, but as the design is solid no claims on kits are made. I have had to handle waranty claims with no problems at all.

Dealers and aftermarket support ARE the issue here because VEMS is a commercial product.

P.S. I am VERY defensive about the VEMS project because I spend every spare hour of my life working on it. And what I post here is not IMHO it comes from being the UK Agent for VEMS.

There is a very negative attitude to VEMS from the MS community which is a shame. MS is a great kit for people that want to solder up a system to learn about engine management.
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11-24-2006, 09:07 PM
Post: #43
VEMS discussion
No problem to be defensive Bob.
You just confirmed my point - VEMS is now commersial product unlike MS.
Just to clarify (because you are VEMS agent - i.e. official) - are VEMS releases up to 3.2 GPL or no one can build them freely ?
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11-24-2006, 10:14 PM
Post: #44
VEMS discussion
Jamie, i personally dont see your arguement.

Why do you want to bother with MS?
It takes longer, isnt as user friendly, isnt as stable and is frankly a waste of time for the money.

I build and tune engines for a living, you wont catch me wasting mine or the customers time and money fitting an inferior product with not 'official' line of support.

Let me ask you think........what question could you ask about VEMS issues that someone could not answer? Or do you prefer to have every possible answer hidden somewhere on a forum for you to go searching?

I deal with many other ECU's than VEMS, and Rob is the quickest reply and solid answer and the first person to come round personally and help if i need it. I used OMEX and i dont anymore because the director and technical staff couldnt answer my questions about their own systems........and they are still fixing flaws many many many years later.

I used alot of other ECU's and support is via an email or telephone call........which is the same as VEMS......the difference is their product is more expensive and doesnt feature the same features most of the time for comparable cost ECU's.

I cant see one reason to use MS?

Its like raising a cow, then killing and skinning it, tanning the hide into leather all so you can make a shoe yourself. Why not buy a shoe?
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11-24-2006, 11:42 PM
Post: #45
VEMS discussion
Megasquirt will cost me $200+ in Bulgaria and will cover 90% of custom ECU demands here (and not only here). Without calls to UK, without dealing with dealers etc.

VEMS will cost me over 340 pounds in UK, have no warranty (like MS) and I must contact dealer or his support everytime when I have problem.

But I asked something more important (for me) - are VEMS releases up to 3.2 GPL or no one can build them freely ? I personally prefer VEMS extras over MS.
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11-25-2006, 01:41 AM
Post: #46
VEMS discussion
Im not sponsored or paid to say it but VEMS is very good. For a start, it makes you win. Here are some pictures of me, wining. haha.. Thumbs up!

[Image: AEU86 AE86 - VEMS discussion]
[Image: AEU86 AE86 - VEMS discussion]
[Image: AEU86 AE86 - VEMS discussion]

Secondly, who mentioned the aftermarket support was lacking? Fully not true, one of the finest things about VEMS is the support ive got from Bob during my VEMS period. Its coming up to a year with VEMS installed, 16v Bluetop, 8500rpm revlimit, Throttle Bodies, CoilPack Ignition and my very own Wideband o2 sensor. As said, installed and running in a day and half, mapped myself.

I'll be getting pics of the install and entire car soon as my setup looks excellent these days. I fully recomend the system if you want to run ITB's or anything else.

Driftworks - JSPFab.com - DangerStyle - NightSpirit
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11-25-2006, 04:42 AM
Post: #47
VEMS discussion
jamiemirror Wrote:Megasquirt will cost me $200+ in Bulgaria and will cover 90% of custom ECU demands here (and not only here). Without calls to UK, without dealing with dealers etc.

VEMS will cost me over 340EU in UK, have no warranty (like MS) and I must contact dealer or his support everytime when I have problem.

But I asked something more important (for me) - are VEMS releases up to 3.2 GPL or no one can build them freely ? I personally prefer VEMS extras over MS.

MS will cost less, but take more time and it doesnt have all the features.

VEMS have no warrenty?
I think that has been discussed already.........it does.

Support? What support do you get with MS. If you have a problem who do you contact? Billy bob in his garage via email who put one on his golf 1.3 driver and is making 74bhp?

I still dont see any point to use MS.

Think about it, if your concerned with money.......then tunning an AE86 is totally the wrong hobby.
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11-25-2006, 11:27 AM
Post: #48
VEMS discussion
Guys, don't get me wrong.
As I already stated - I like VEMS. But somenone here insyst to discuss MS vs VEMS - so I replied. BadDog runs redtop in his AE86 with MS, COPs, WB (ZT2) etc. - so Pazza, I can't see really your advance in ECU ?

BenR, what is exact warranty of VEMS ECU ? Don't say "some general EU warranty terms" - be more specific please ? And why don't contact Billy Bob when his setup works ? Maybe just because he "don't make this for living" ? Yes, MS lacks some extras but in fact covers over 90% of requirements.

At last - I personally think that AE86 modifications are cheap - compared with cars like S13, Skyline, Supra, Celica, Lancer Evo etc. Maybe you compare it with Moris Mini Cooper or VAZ (Lada) - but this is not an issue here. AE86 is (relatively) cheap platform with good response to modifications - and good aftermarket support. Why I must spend large amounts of money meaningfully - just to buy brands instead of parts ? If I waht to do that - I can buy Skyline.

PS: Again - is VEMS GPL or not ? And guys - I don't want to flame here - lets keep discussion VEMS-centric. No one said "VEMS is bad".
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11-25-2006, 12:41 PM
Post: #49
VEMS discussion
jamiemirror Wrote:so Pazza, I can't see really your advance in ECU ?

I won! I couldnt of done it with the stock ECU or MS. Hhahaha.. Nah im just being a dick, but i do enjoy VEMS.

Driftworks - JSPFab.com - DangerStyle - NightSpirit
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11-25-2006, 01:14 PM
Post: #50
VEMS discussion
Okay, congrats Pazza !
But I have AE86 circuit race videos and the winner was equipped with 48 DCOEs (AFAIK), overtaking easily TRD AE86 with well tuned EFI Tongue

Could you please explain about your EFI installation and tune etc (if there is something to not be disclosed - no problem) ? Problems, solutions, patches and fixes ?
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